Pete Holmes is one of the current thoughtful and sharp comedians making waves on social media. One of his recent viral jokes is a stinging critique of the long-standing conflict between, as he calls it, “The God people and the Science people.”
In this recent instagram clip from this podcast Pete is found deconstructing the joke. I love it when writers do this. He goes slowly. Pay attention and we can begin to see how the joke works. One line sets up the next, setting up a laugh. It’s quite skillful.
For all his skill using language and instigating laughter, Pete gets something really big really wrong. As many times as I’ve heard the joke at pace, and laughed, I didn’t notice the mistake until I listened to him tell the joke slowly.
Let’s take a look.
I’ve written out the joke here, editing for harsh language, alongside my own commentary, beat by beat:
Pete begins,
Some people say nothing created the universe, which is the funniest guess. They say God doesn’t exist.
He sets up the Atheist point of view, and where he stands in the argument. This checks out.
Yeah maybe, but you know what definitely doesn’t exist. Nothing. That’s defining characteristic of nothing, that it doesn’t exist.
He sets up the logical falsity of the Atheist position. This also checks out.
So what are we talking about? You’re either talking about nothing, something you can’t see, touch, taste, photograph, and science can’t prove, created the universe. Or God, something you can’t see, touch, taste, photograph, and science can’t prove, created the universe.
Here Pete begins his journey towards reconciling the two positions. This is admittedly a broad-brushed comparison designed for impact, not accuracy. I’ll concede the comparison – although many have experienced seeing God – because there’s something more important that comes up later.
If one of the things your nothing does is spontaneously erupt into everything. That’s a pretty magical nothing, you guys.
Pete continues his journey of comically comparing the two sides. I find it striking that he chooses to use the word magical here. Not fantastic, supernatural, or even miraculous. In the book of Exodus in the Old Testament, there is a distinction set between the miracles done by the God of the Hebrews through Moses and the works done by the magicians of Pharaoh’s court. This initial distinction eventually develops into a distrust, animosity, and outright opposition towards anything even resembling magic by many in the Christian faith. Nice word choice, Pete.
Then ask the nothing people what happens when you die, they’ll tell you, “You go back into nothing.” You mean you merge back with your creator? That’s heaven!
That’s the punchline. Heaven is the punchline. Powerful. It lands every time. After all, heaven is when you go back to your creator, right? In the video Pete explains that what he’s trying to do is just say that nothing and God are two words we use to describe a mystery. We are more similar than we are different. Therefore, we should be working together rather than fighting.
This is an expression of classic mysticism and suffers from the same lack of concreteness and differentiation that is necessary to lead someone into the very disposition Pete is talking about.
On of the propositions of Jesus Christ is the idea that heaven has a two way direction. It is not only what happens when we die – us going towards heaven. It is what God has done through Jesus, and continues to do with his Spirit today – heaven coming to earth, and to each one of us.
The basic proposition is that a life with God is something that we can experience beginning now. We don’t have to wait. There is an open invitation, a way, and the means made available to journey towards this. It is this very life with God that leads to miraculous transformation in a person.
This is not, “just try to live a good life, and hope you get into heaven in the end,” religion.
Pete’s punchline relies on the idea that the experience of heaven is reserved for after death. It is a place that we go only after we die. Or deeper, that one of the key things religions disagree on is what happens after we die. But if we’re more similar than different in this respect, why are we fighting?
Point taken. However, there are two ways to attempt to circumvent division. One is to minimize differences. The other is to increase our capacity to love.
From the perspective of a mystic – that is someone who has a personal relationship with God – differences are minimized because the individuals capacity for love is increased. There is wonder and freedom in the life of the mystic because of their experience of love. But that love is concrete. And the way to that life is concrete.
Pete’s joke falls apart when we consider the two-way direction of heaven that Jesus proposes. Imagine trying to compare heaven breaking into the our earthly experience to a magical nothing breaking into the it. What would the characteristics of a life with a magical nothing be? How would a life with a magical nothing change you?
The transformative power of a life with God is there because God is a persona, evidenced in the person of Jesus Christ, and accessible to us through spiritual relationship. God can know us, and we can know God – at least enough to be changed.
While it is honorable to seek connection with others, especially with those who may have different ideas, there is a danger in desiring connection over reality. The reality is that propositions of life differ in concrete ways. Some lead to freedom and wonder and an outpouring of love. Others don’t. In this case, a faith that is rooted in love, and journeys toward a union with divine love is what actually allows connections across divides to be made in the first place. It’s not nothing.
Your last paragraph … very powerful. So well written. God’s love is transformative in our lives now, not just in our eternal destination. And that changes lives and relationships and communities in very concrete ways that definitely matter.